tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post1782152913833112575..comments2024-03-16T00:21:43.240+00:00Comments on Separated by a Common Language: stemware and other wareslynneguisthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10171345732985610861noreply@blogger.comBlogger38125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-75926273567163490032023-01-08T04:50:06.355+00:002023-01-08T04:50:06.355+00:00The "knives, forks, spoons" sense of cut...The "knives, forks, spoons" sense of <i>cutlery</i> was added to the historical OED in a draft addition in 2016. They didn't put a region label on it; maybe they will when they do the full revision. <br /><br />To me (American), <i>cutlery</i> is sharp knives for chopping or carving, not table utensils — and not scissors, either. However, I asked my Californian in-laws over the holidays, and some of them did know it as knives/forks/spoons. ktschwarznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-79957406724226365732022-12-29T10:38:13.677+00:002022-12-29T10:38:13.677+00:00The current Oxford dictionary (which is the built-...The current Oxford dictionary (which is the built-in dictionary on the iPhone, Kindle, and Google) does have <i>stemware</i> labeled as "North American"; it's often better than the big historical OED at labeling US/UK differences, especially for words where the big OED isn't recently revised.ktschwarznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-59428256364793472072022-12-28T11:25:52.459+00:002022-12-28T11:25:52.459+00:00A post-holiday email ad provided perfect evidence ...A post-holiday email ad provided perfect evidence for Lynne’s observation, “In my AmE experience, the more common use of cutlery (not that it's a common word) is to refer to cutting instruments--e.g. knives and scissors (what was traditionally made by a cutler).” From https://www.surlatable.com/home, a Seattle-based kinda-national kitchenware 😉retailer…kinda-sorta like 🇬🇧 Conan’s, maybe?<br /><br />Subject line: Now that's a price cut: Cutlery deals up to 70% off!<br /><br />On offer: all knives—sets with blocks from Henckels, a santoku, a 7” chef’s knife—except for one fork that’s half of a carving set. Want 🇬🇧 “cutlery”? That’s in the “flatware” section; you’ll also see “dinnerware” and “drinkware.” <br />Christian Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17561529462675001889noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-41618320496112678712020-08-08T21:45:43.627+01:002020-08-08T21:45:43.627+01:00BrE (Scot, 60+) I don’t think I would ever refer t...BrE (Scot, 60+) I don’t think I would ever refer to cutlery as “utensils”, although I like the term “eating irons” which, until someone puts me right, I will assume I picked up from cowboy films and books. To me, utensils are kitchen tools, like tongs, fish slices, wooden/plastic spoons for stirring, etc.<br /><br />I once knew three girls who worked on checkouts by day, and were backing singers for various bands in the evening. They called themselves the checkout chicks.Shy-replyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01891566073375322808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-39387134383582733972015-01-12T22:39:42.062+00:002015-01-12T22:39:42.062+00:00There are the "wear" words. Footwear. ...There are the "wear" words. Footwear. Outerwear. Underwear. Perhaps even eyewear (glasses/spectacles).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-10405117481634318242012-12-16T23:55:28.551+00:002012-12-16T23:55:28.551+00:00Mrs Reboots
I hadn't appreciated that "s...Mrs Reboots<br /><br /><i>I hadn't appreciated that "set the table" was especially AmE - I lay the table, but thought I was a bit old-fashioned for doing so; I'm sure my daughter sets hers!</i><br /><br />This was the very real difference I learnt of between the varieties — apart from trivial differences like <i>sidewalk/pavement</i>. A gang of Brits and one American were training to teach an eccentric English course in Rome. The American had been teaching in Tunisia and had found it hilarious that the English textbook wrote of performing such a perverse act upon a table.<br /><br />I didn't realise (or haven't noticed) that <i>set the table</i> has even reached Britain — let alone conquered.David Crosbiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01858358459416955921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-8340258048918977202012-12-16T23:40:40.071+00:002012-12-16T23:40:40.071+00:00ihrsta 3wtanksley
a "flat" means an en...ihrsta 3wtanksley<br /><br /><i> a "flat" means an entire floor of an apartment building</i><br /><br />Until very recently, that was true of Scottish tenement buildings. However, the is caused confusion with the meaning of <i>flat</i> elsewhere in Britain.David Crosbiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01858358459416955921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-11407108260892111072012-12-16T23:36:00.235+00:002012-12-16T23:36:00.235+00:00Elian
I'm British and in my late sixties. I ...Elian <br /><br />I'm British and in my late sixties. I don't say <i>shop attendant</i>, and to the best of my recollection I never have. They are — and I believe they always were — <i>shop assistants</i>. We can now also say <i>sales assistants</i>.<br /><br />We used to speak of <i>cloakroom attendants</i>, and perhaps we still do. We used to speak of <i>petrol pump attendants</i>, but they no loner exist. Nor, I think, do <i>car park attendants</i>. Also <i>deck chair attendants</i> and <i>museum attendants</i>.<br /><br /><i>Shop assistant, bank clerk</i> (never <i>teller</i>) and <i>park keepers</i>.<br /><br />New-fangled places like <i>supernarkets</i> simply have <i>workers</i>.<br /><br />The general rule seems to be that <i>clerks</i> did sums — those that didn't write letters. <i>Attendants</i> looked after places, and possibly collected simple fees. Only <i>petrol pump attendants</i> made the same calcuaations as <i>shop assistants</i>.David Crosbiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01858358459416955921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-8633745793805771122012-12-16T20:07:56.710+00:002012-12-16T20:07:56.710+00:00That's a lot of questions, and I try not to an...That's a lot of questions, and I try not to answer questions unrelated to the post in the comments section. But:<br /><br />Yes to 'cookware'.<br />No 'whiteware' or 'brownware'.<br /><br />'Tend bar', but you wouldn't 'tend' a front desk. I'd say 'deliver mail' for a letter carrier, and I wouldn't use 'clerk' as a verb much, though I wouldn't say it's impossible. When I did it, I 'worked the checkout' at a supermarket.<br />lynneguisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10171345732985610861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-68200376868649560472012-12-16T16:34:18.681+00:002012-12-16T16:34:18.681+00:00Hi Lynnguist, if kitchenware refers to kitchen ute...Hi Lynnguist, if kitchenware refers to kitchen utensils including bowls, plates and cups, cookware thusly refer to cooking appliances including saucepans, frypans, pots, ovens and blenders) don't they? <br />Are whiteware (fridge, dishwasher, etc.) and brownware (audio and video systems)more widespread in AmE usage than white goods and brown goods?<br />In addition, considering that in AmeE "wait tables" means "work as a waitperson/server/(joc.)waitron" and "teach school" is defined as "to work as a teacher", can you in the same way say "tend bar" for working as a bartender/barkeep, "tend front desk" for working as a hotel front desk clerk, and "carry mail" for serving as as a mail carrier? <br />Also, considering that a salesclerk/store clerk is a shop attendant in BrE, that a front desk clerk/room clerk is a BrE hotel receptionist, and that clerk can be used as a verb in both BrE and AmE with the meaning "work/serve as a clerk", do "clerk in a store" for working as a store clerk and "clerk at a hotel front desk" for working as a front desk clerk sound right to American ears?Elianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16930398121025074531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-57799594528650351412010-06-18T12:03:28.886+01:002010-06-18T12:03:28.886+01:00As a slight diversion for this, my ex-wife's (...As a slight diversion for this, my ex-wife's (very posh) family all share a strange and to me (with a lower-middle-class english accent) rather bothersome pronunciation of the word "Cutlery".<br /><br />The pronounce it "Cuttle-ree" - as in "Cuttle fish".<br /><br />They also tend to pronounce "Recipe" like "Receipt" (which I know is an old pre-francified way of saying it), but I'm sure it's an error, andit still irritates me.Andy Holyernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-4728151252014360192009-11-11T05:45:42.400+00:002009-11-11T05:45:42.400+00:00Very interesting discussion regarding the -ware su...Very interesting discussion regarding the -ware suffix. Kiwis also use the term cutlery for knives, forks and spoons. Silver(ware) refers to silver-plated utensils, which only very wealthy people would own.<br /><br />Tableware makes sense, and kitchenware must refer to bowls, plates and cups. Also, we have always used the term "setting the table" to refer to putting out cutlery and crockery (utensils and plates / bowls).<br /><br />I've heard Americans refer to silverware when they actually mean stainless steel meal utensils. In my mind it doesn't make sense, as these implements aren't silver at all!Geckomayhemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13401256567387933821noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-80475077795408228312008-10-22T05:05:00.000+01:002008-10-22T05:05:00.000+01:00Hmm, I've always assumed that "flatware" was crock...Hmm, I've always assumed that "flatware" was crockery.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-32888989450902974112008-10-01T16:02:00.000+01:002008-10-01T16:02:00.000+01:00It was interesting to read your entry about the Am...It was interesting to read your entry about the AmE/BrE difference between silverware and cutlery. Being Canadian, we tend to more BrE usage than AmE. This past summer we had a family gathering that included a cousin who now lives in the U.S. with her son, who is born and so far raised there. An amusing dispute arose amongst the younger set about whether they were using cutlery or silverware. I'd never thought about the difference before.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-52687461376360493342008-09-29T23:05:00.000+01:002008-09-29T23:05:00.000+01:00The 'silver' in silver service refers to cutleryThe 'silver' in silver service refers to cutleryAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-83690830064325298012008-09-29T10:57:00.000+01:002008-09-29T10:57:00.000+01:00In Australia cutlery is most commonly used for kni...In Australia cutlery is most commonly used for knives, forks etc. but utensils is also occasionly used. Silverware sounds very upper class and posh to me but I would understand what was meant.<BR/><BR/>I have never heard of stemware (and neither has my spell checker). We simply call such things wine glasses, even the ones not used for wine. For example we'd call a champagne flute a type of wine glass.<BR/><BR/>In fact I don't think we use very many ware words at all. Instead of tablewear we are much more likely to say cutlery and crockery.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-12027121723316647792008-09-27T03:35:00.000+01:002008-09-27T03:35:00.000+01:00Growing up (NY) it was "set the table" and lay out...Growing up (NY) it was "set the table" and lay out the "silverware" whether it was actually the silver stuff or the stainless steel. Now we tend to say "utensils".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-83798303135908086492008-09-27T00:13:00.000+01:002008-09-27T00:13:00.000+01:00Walked by a charity shop in Brighton today that ha...Walked by a <A HREF="http://separatedbyacommonlanguage.blogspot.com/2006/05/charity-shopthrift-store.html" REL="nofollow">charity shop</A> in Brighton today that had "kitchenware" and "tableware" painted on its front window. So, at least I know those ones are currently used in BrE!lynneguisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10171345732985610861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-39622443960421352942008-09-26T21:12:00.000+01:002008-09-26T21:12:00.000+01:00I'm just waiting for clothing to be described as w...I'm just waiting for clothing to be described as wearware. I've already seen "wearing apparel" in the US, which struck me as delightfully tautological.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-14144001662083427482008-09-26T14:56:00.000+01:002008-09-26T14:56:00.000+01:00There are definitions among potters for earthenwar...There are definitions among potters for earthenware, stoneware and what-have-you-ware depending on composition, firing temperatures, glazing temperatures and so forth. The definitions probably vary from place to place.MattFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02575754086517238690noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-71954105979092155372008-09-26T14:49:00.000+01:002008-09-26T14:49:00.000+01:00It looks like "Kitcheware" is used in the UK...of ...It looks like "Kitcheware" is used in the UK...of course my only real evidence of that is that it is said in the opening theme of "Are You Being Served?" ;)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-17242329009724241742008-09-26T13:51:00.000+01:002008-09-26T13:51:00.000+01:00Earthenware (dishes to go in the oven)? Certainly ...Earthenware (dishes to go in the oven)? Certainly UK, but I don't know about US usage.<BR/><BR/>I have this mental image of a 13th-century pedlar displaying his wares, and I'm pretty sure that wine glasses are not in the pack!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-41279690268384664982008-09-25T21:37:00.000+01:002008-09-25T21:37:00.000+01:00For me (Irish) "ironmonger" sounds prewar and "har...For me (Irish) "ironmonger" sounds prewar and "hardware shop" just plain wrong; it's got to be a "hardware store". shop/store are the defaults for UK/US, but specific cases can go either way.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-58475676373421865382008-09-25T18:25:00.000+01:002008-09-25T18:25:00.000+01:00I'm not sure whether housewares is AmE-only (Merri...I'm not sure whether <I>housewares</I> is AmE-only (Merriam Webster Online doesn't include such notes), but I'm curious why it's always plural, in contrast to all the other examples so far. Perhaps because it's a metacategory that includes flatware, dinnerware, cookware, etc.?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-3600638841160656102008-09-25T17:02:00.000+01:002008-09-25T17:02:00.000+01:00http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archive...http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/004890.html<BR/><BR/>Whiteware.<BR/><BR/>I only just now notice that I've been revealed my full name on that page. Thank you, Pullum. [Makes note to only use this email in future.]Jens Knudsen (Sili)https://www.blogger.com/profile/14078875730565068352noreply@blogger.com