tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post6357292160346309955..comments2024-03-16T00:21:43.240+00:00Comments on Separated by a Common Language: some light verbslynneguisthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10171345732985610861noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-46537157274363959602017-05-21T13:04:29.084+01:002017-05-21T13:04:29.084+01:00I see this suggestion doesn't square with the ...I see this suggestion doesn't square with the terminology you start from. So let me tentatively rephrase....<br /><br />UNERGATIVE VERBS<br /><i>look 1</i> — 'direct one's visually attention and observe'<br /><i>shower 1</i> — 'initiate and follow though the process of showering'<br /><i>nap 1</i> — 'decide on and carry out a brief sleep'<br /><br />UNACCUSATIVE VERBS<br /><i>look 2</i> — 'see for a short while, as planned'<br /><i>shower 2</i> — 'enjoy the sensation of showering'<br /><i>nap 2</i> — 'experience a short sleep, possible as planned'<br /><br />I can now suggest that <br />• unergative verbs invite <i>take</i> as a light verb<br />• unaccusative verbs invite <i>have</i> as a light verb<br />Then<br />• a light verb causes the lexical(?) verb to transform into a noun phrase<br /><br />Even more tentatively...<br /><br />Since <i>I looked, I showered, I napped </i> etc can be ambiguous between unergativity and unaccusativity, some of use some of the time resolve the ambiguity (if we notice it) by rephrasing with the appropriate light verb.David Crosbiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01858358459416955921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-4180432339141324432017-05-21T02:11:42.384+01:002017-05-21T02:11:42.384+01:00Lynne
Better Half might well have given different...Lynne<br /><br />Better Half might well have given different answers to 3-5 of your quiz if you'd phrased them with different modality/polarity. e.g.<br /><br />3. I managed to ____ a look at that document.<br />4. There wasn't time time to ____ a shower.<br />5. I really don't want to _____ a nap.<br /><br />As it happens, I've been trying (not for the first time) to get my head around <b>unaccusative</b> and <b>unergative</b> verbs. I wonder whether I make a distinction (not consistently, but fairly often) between<br /><br /><i>take a shower</i> etc — <b>unergative</b> I actively go about it.<br /><i>have a shower</i> etc <b>unaccusative</b> I passively let the water do its work.<br /><br />Yes, of course there is agency in looking, showering and napping. But I think I perceive the agency as <b>preceding</b> a more passive phase of experience. The <i>take</i> versions (I think) highlight the initial agency and the <i>have</i> versions the resulting passivity.David Crosbiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01858358459416955921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-29832341252376817812014-07-09T07:45:21.008+01:002014-07-09T07:45:21.008+01:00I'm an editor for a management consultancy tha...I'm an editor for a management consultancy that started in the US but is now global. We typically edit in US English, but that's largely a practical decision stemming from the nationalities of the editors involved. In a pinch, we switch to other Englishes as requested; since we're writing business prose, the changes are usually minimal and cause me little difficulty.<br /><br />Except. <br /><br />Like every editor, I have my irrational obsessions. And I hate, loathe, despise, abhor, detest, and abominate unto God the phrase <i>take a decision</i>.<br /><br />It's the metaphor that plucks every individual fiber of my very American nervous system. Decisions aren't something you take down from shelf, prebaked, preformed, premasticated and predigested for all I know. Any decision worth talking about is created, forged, formed -- maybe even tempered or annealed. It is <i>made</i>, dammit. <br /><br />Any decision that's <i>taken</i> might as well result from a coin toss, so who cares?Christian Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17561529462675001889noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-58605877074576168342014-05-18T21:46:04.156+01:002014-05-18T21:46:04.156+01:00I need to go on holiday.I need to go on holiday.Neil Rashbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14217111205775776357noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-76765821171277290112012-12-18T10:23:02.418+00:002012-12-18T10:23:02.418+00:00Hey Lynneguist, do you see any difference tone wis...Hey Lynneguist, do you see any difference tone wise between "have a seat" and "take a seat?" I'd say that the former sounds more like the polite way to offer somebody to be seated, like a host to a ghest, whereas the latter sounds more direct and less friendly, like what a teacher may say to a student. What do you think?Elianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16930398121025074531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-31941145856934705312010-01-22T04:31:24.855+00:002010-01-22T04:31:24.855+00:002-5 have, 1 and 6 get2-5 have, 1 and 6 getRWMGhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04271851970303022440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-89712206444834221052007-10-08T13:59:00.000+01:002007-10-08T13:59:00.000+01:00You're right, of course. See my previous posting ...You're right, of course. See <A HREF="http://separatedbyacommonlanguage.blogspot.com/2007/07/different-fromthanto.html" REL="nofollow">my previous posting on the subject</A>.<BR/><BR/>Will go back and change it now to a dialectally-neutral 'from'!lynneguisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10171345732985610861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-67610235284497819462007-10-08T10:47:00.000+01:002007-10-08T10:47:00.000+01:00Off topic but on blog entry: I get the feeling tha...Off topic but on blog entry: I get the feeling that "The reason, of course, is that some people speak different dialects than other people" should have been flagged up as AmE...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-24347727777224855122007-10-07T11:10:00.000+01:002007-10-07T11:10:00.000+01:00Jhm, everything is foreign to almost everyone. For...Jhm, everything is foreign to almost everyone. Foreign from what perspective?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-61507703069850778462007-10-07T00:49:00.000+01:002007-10-07T00:49:00.000+01:00I would use 'do' for the last one: "I need to do ...I would use 'do' for the last one: "I need to do some exercise".<BR/><BR/>Neither 'take' nor 'have' sound right to me. (AusE)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-34052544891091115892007-10-06T13:47:00.000+01:002007-10-06T13:47:00.000+01:00It doesn't seem to fit the definition of light ver...It doesn't seem to fit the definition of light verb, but I've always found 'make a right/left' foreign sounding compared to 'take a right/left.'jhmhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15024302748759726815noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-59181335964176202402007-10-06T03:52:00.000+01:002007-10-06T03:52:00.000+01:00There was a long thread about "make/take a decisio...There was a long thread about "make/take a decision" on <A HREF="http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usage.english/browse_frm/thread/544768ffcaf5285f/" REL="nofollow">alt.usage.english</A> a few months ago.Ben Zimmerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02927962158447853691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-59397482487028961812007-10-06T03:10:00.000+01:002007-10-06T03:10:00.000+01:00Thanks for the reply, Lynne. Very interesting!Thanks for the reply, Lynne. Very interesting!Marian Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13932728225710870295noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-80321341399722683942007-10-06T01:22:00.000+01:002007-10-06T01:22:00.000+01:00There is also AmE take a T versus BrE have a T, wh...There is also AmE <I>take a T</I> versus BrE <I>have a T</I>, where <I>T</I> is any of various four-letter terms for excrements.John Cowanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11452247999156925669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-81073717399485469162007-10-06T00:10:00.000+01:002007-10-06T00:10:00.000+01:00I need to get some exercise. Grabby, taking people...I need to get some exercise. Grabby, taking people, us Am/E speakers.Zhoenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03515663141425057088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28787909.post-53933238669432316412007-10-05T23:56:00.000+01:002007-10-05T23:56:00.000+01:00"Take a girl like you.""Make a girl like you."Hm."Take a girl like you."<BR/>"Make a girl like you."<BR/>Hm.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com